After 3 hours of debating about style and play of today...

[ed]

joey fleshman and henry dineen are a LOT of fun to watch. i get a kick out of watching henry just work combos out on a dead yo-yo, let alone when he's playing for real. with joey, i always EXPECT to understand what's going on, and then he just does something that makes me say "wait, what?"

those two guys have forgotten more about yo-yoing than i'll ever know.
most of the other folks i dig on have already been addressed.

to answer the question. i don't care if a yo-yoer is fast or slow, or even smooth or choppy. what i really try to look for is INTENT. does their brain settle and hesitate in the middle of a trick, or do they just DO THE TRICK. it's a hard thing for me to describe, but it makes all the difference in the world, and if you have it, it completely validates your skill and style regardless of how quick or slow it may be. it isn't even important to me that you hit all of your stuff cleanly, so much as it does that your stuff clearly MATTERS to you. intent.

EDIT!
adam brewster and alex berenguel also exemplify all that i like and aspire to within yo-yoing.

[drewtetz]

A lot of people will set existing tricks to slow music and then act and pose very dramatically in order to make yo-yoing look like "art". I find that to be shortsighted, foolish, and boring to watch.

Yeah, I don't really like the idea that "slow = dramatic = artistic". I would love to see an AP with somebody screaming and crying and writhing on the floor. I mean, they'd have to be sincere, but i would be way more into that.

That's kind of why I like watching Miggy. His style is so... raw. His tricks don't look as open-and-shut as a lot of the other top competitors, but I know he puts a ton of thought into trick design and I get the feeling that he means what he does. Do I sound like a hippy? Whatever. There it is.

[jakebullock]

I'm not referring to you, Steve. Even if you were standing there using a black yoyo in front of a black background and an unclipped song, you were doing unusual, interesting stuff and even pulling out multiple actual hubstack tricks, finally lending some credibility to all the hype. You kept me interested, for what it's worth.

I suppose it's more just the 'genre' of 5A that I have trouble getting excited about; counterweight play naturally lends itself more to slower but not necessarily more complicated stuff. There is plenty of room for very difficult, complicated, and/or cool-looking tricks, but a great portion of what I see in freestyles is usually a bunch of variations on the same set of tricks, which get old pretty soon if there isn't some variation or showmanship of some sort. One almost gets the impression that they're just trying to get by on smoothness alone. If I had to start naming names, Jake Bullock would be in there, as would Shane Karan (though, to be fair, I haven't seen any of his 5A since he won 04 nats, and nowadays he seems to be getting easier to watch in other styles). Their skill is undeniable, and they'll throw in a few moves nobody else is doing, but for most of their freestyles I'm sitting there wanting to fast forward. A lot of it is the style, but there's also a lack of stage presence. I just...well, I can't feel excited if they aren't even excited.

On the other hand, we have Makoto Numagami, who generally uses somewhat straightforward moves, but does them cleanly and elegantly, dresses appropriately, and sets a routine to music. One gets the feeling he put a bit of thought and work into his freestyle, and took it fairly seriously. He's sort of the 5A equivalent of Tomonari Ishiguro. Then there's Augie Fash, who is well known for his 1A speed, and he also puts a lot of speed into 5A. Many of his moves, compared to some, are relatively simple stuff, but he does it fast enough that sometimes it's hard to keep up just watching. He also does aerial tricks, which are fun and flashy and which many tech 5Aers seem to shun. He plays the crowd a bit without going overboard. He makes an effort to be fun to watch. He gets my vote for excitement. I like these guys not so much for their innovation as the fact that I find them more entertaining and interesting than most.

Of course, this is all the opinion of some random yoyoer who's only been around for a couple years. I suppose what I say should be taken with an appropriate amount of salt.

And, it seems, while I was typing this, a couple new posts have happened. Looks like I may not view things exactly the way you do, but hey.

ok, so you like showmanship, and talent show type performances with old tricks performed perfectly with the music and fancy costumes, rather then someone actually attempting new tricks that are hard to do. that's ok.

if you are referring to my Worlds 06 era tricks, then yes, they are slow and repetitive and basic. if i could go back in time and not compete at Worlds 2006, i would, because i wasn't close to skilled enough to be on the stage at that time.

but if you're referring to the things i've been doing since Nationals 2006 up until now, I don't understand. I go on stage and attempt as many hard and new tricks as i can, sometimes having made them up the night before. i'm not a good competitor, but i have fun trying to hit all my tricks on a stage in front of my peers. i try my best to never repeat freestyles and always attempt to have at least one new trick.

if all my new tricks looks the same to you, you need to pay more attention. in my opinion, all of makoto's tricks are unoriginal and repetitive, but you seem to love him simply because he puts on a good show.

if you just don't like technical 5A, that's ok, join the club, no one likes technical 5A.

[Elephark]

I like to watch stuff that's performed well. If someone comes out with a crapload of tricks nobody's done before, but doesn't perform them well, I'd rather walk away and practice myself than watch it. Yoyoing is very visual, yoyo performance doubly so. Given the choice between someone drawing a basket of fruit and doing it well or drawing something potentially interesting that I've never seen before and doing it shoddily, I'll take the fruit.

Getting up on stage is a great way to showcase new tricks, but the level of stage presence can turn an otherwise great freestyle into a dull and boring one—or vice versa.

This is just the opinion of some no-name yoyoer who doesn't care too much for 5A to begin with. Salt to taste.

[jakebullock]

I like to watch stuff that's performed well. If someone comes out with a crapload of tricks nobody's done before, but doesn't perform them well, I'd rather walk away and practice myself than watch it. Yoyoing is very visual, yoyo performance doubly so. Given the choice between someone drawing a basket of fruit and doing it well or drawing something potentially interesting that I've never seen before and doing it shoddily, I'll take the fruit.

Getting up on stage is a great way to showcase new tricks, but the level of stage presence can turn an otherwise great freestyle into a dull and boring one—or vice versa.

This is just the opinion of some no-name yoyoer who doesn't care too much for 5A to begin with. Salt to taste.

ok, fine, that's understandable. i have the opposite viewpoint, i'd rather see something new and terribly sloppy, then something old and perfectly executed.

we'll agree to disagree.

[Nathan]

And I'd rather see something new and perfectly executed
 

[jakebullock]

And I'd rather see something new and perfectly executed
 

doesn't seem to happen often these days, especially in 5A. but of course that's the ideal option.

[Elephark]

ok, fine, that's understandable. i have the opposite viewpoint, i'd rather see something new and terribly sloppy, then something old and perfectly executed.

we'll agree to disagree.

Sounds okay to me.

And agreed on the ideal-option-ness.

[WasKnownAsYoNick]

what i think elephark is not understanding is that a yo-yo competition is supposed to be about pushing technical play and innovation rather than a performance piece.

John and Rebecca Higby put on a killer performance when they do their show

Jake Bullock blows my mind when I watch his freestyles

one is a performance piece, the other a competition piece

maybe im wrong, but that is how ive always looked at it

-nick

[Sottle]

This topic was about favourite players, not players who should win contests.

So if Elephark wants to preach his love of showmanship, he's more that entitled to.

[GbH]

I like to see stuff that has a magic quality that can't quite be put into words.  Sometimes this can come from smoothness, control and attention to every detail.  But on other times, the magic can result from will-he-or-won't-he-make-it moments where the roughness actually adds to the overall effect.   I like to see performers who appear to show an interest in what they're doing and also an interest in those that are watching them.  I also like to see performers who understand pacing and how to use tempo changes to their advantage.  Sure, I love to see cool new things, but 'new' doesn't always mean 'interesting' and novelty certainly shouldn't be used as an excuse for avoiding the performance elements that are required of a truely memorable routine.

It frustrates me when I see people write 'I don't like Green Triangles' or 'E-Fans are boring' or even 'I don't like 5A'.  It's not the trick or style that's boring, it's the performer.  For instance, I could watch five 5A videos showing players doing E Fans and take little notice.  Then I might see an Augie or Tyler freestyle and  wow - it suddenly looks a lot more interesting, even though it's exactly the same trick.

Finally, if you're thinking this doesn't apply to xA style technical competitions, then just watch Yuuki's recent Worlds winning freestyle again.  Only, don't watch the tricks, just watch Yuuki himself.  Notice the extra movements, not required as part of the tricks?  Notice the eye contact with the audience?  Notice the (point losing?) long gaps in between tricks?  So, were such subtle actions worth doing?  Well, you only have to consider the end result and the crowd's reaction to get your answer.


Guy

[yo_doc]

This topic was about favourite players, not players who should win contests.

So if Elephark wants to preach his love of showmanship, he's more that entitled to.

THANK YOU SIMON!!!!

[Cymbal monkey]

I think so too yodoc

[WasKnownAsYoNick]

I never said that Elephark was not entitled to his own opinion, i was stating my opinion just as well as he was, if he likes showmanship, thats rad. I was just stating my opinion as to where I think certain things should be expected. I'm not saying that anyone is wrong or that they shouldn't state their own opinion.

Please calm down before you all raise up an army against me, i would appreciate it

thanks,

nick

[Sottle]

what i think elephark is not understanding

That part of your post indicated you were trying to "correct" Elephark. Without that i wouldn't have said anything. No one here is flaming you, it's just a calm discussion.

[ed]

and this guy.

http://www.yoyoing.com/videos/play.php?vid=3606

[Sottle]

Yeah, Sam's awesome.

[jakebullock]

sam scott's 5A is sick.

[nikoloz]

1A MIckey Suzuki . Why? cuz hes world champion (well maybe not this year) and hes also uber fast

5A Tyler Severance . For the same respective reason.

Speed up your game 

[magikai416]

1A MIckey Suzuki . Why? cuz hes world champion (well maybe not this year) and hes also uber fast

5A Tyler Severance . For the same respective reason.

Speed up your game 

not a really good way to see if someones good...